 |
Message BoardHome > Internet > Message Board
| Author |
Message |
    
Nigel Wearne
Moderator
Username: Nwearne
Post Number: 21
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Monday, February 5, 2007 - 10:28 am: |       |
Treasurers are starting to ring me more frequently about bank charges and low interest rate being credited on their PCC current accounts with the NatWest.
As far as I am aware, there has been no general policy decision by the NatWest to start charging. I am shortly meeting with the diocesan NatWest 'relationship manager' to review the operation of our banking arrangments with them. The charges issue seems to be topical for some of you and some of you seem to feel that your interest earned from the pooling scheme has reduced significantly in 2006 compared to 2005. I would like some detailed examples to quote to see if we can reverse this, if it is a question of local discretion being used in branches to make all accounts more profitable.
This posting is triggered by a specific treasurer this morning being charged £11 a month since November. |
Anthony del Tufo
New member
Username: Adel_tufo
Post Number: 3
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 13, 2007 - 11:34 am: | |
We were with Lloyds TSB and they moved from free banking to charging quite a lot because our "turnover" exceeded £50k, so we have just moved to CAF Bank (part of Charities Aid Foundation) and they offer a higher interest rate as well as free banking. Local banking is via HSBC. |
Caroline Bucklow
New member
Username: Caroline_bucklow
Post Number: 2
Registered: 2-2007
| | Posted on Saturday, February 17, 2007 - 11:37 am: | |
We are still with Lloyds TSB and we have also been moved from free banking to being charged quite a lot. I have put off moving to NatWest and the the pool scheme because it means getting people to write new standing orders. Can't move to CAF bank because we don't have a local HSBC. I'd like to know more about how the pool scheme would actually work for us before I make a decision. |
Steve Wells
New member
Username: Swells
Post Number: 5
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, February 18, 2007 - 5:32 am: | |
NatWest is our main account with a turnover of £130k per year. We have been receiveing 3.4% on at this account - until December when we received 12p interest for the final quarter (£1500 expected) plus Bank Charges of £167 in September and £118 in December when we normally pay nothing. I challenged these and they have been refunded. I await the March Bank Statements with interest! |
Robert Nigel Atkinson
New member
Username: Rob_atkinson
Post Number: 1
Registered: 2-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 20, 2007 - 10:25 am: | |
We are also with NatWest. Our total turnover for 2006 was a little in excess of £33k (not all of this will have been processed via our NatWest current account).
Charges of £17.94 were applied to our account (for the first time in my 5 years as Treasurer) on 29.09.06. I queried this and the charges were refunded to the account on 10.11.06. Only for further charges of £17.58 to be applied on 29.11.06. Again I queried this, but am having more difficulty in the bank agreeing to refund on this occasion, in fact they have not responded to my query. (They also appear to have duplicated our final Parish Share payment of £1239 - also queried - no satisfactory answer yet received). I have visited the local branch (Thame) again this morning to be told that the issue of applying charges is something that has been notified to/agreed with the Diocese (and implying that the Diocese should have informed us). They say this is because this is a ‘Business Account’. They mentioned that I am not the only PCC Treasurer to have queried this. I have been referred to the ‘Relationship Manager’, Evelyn Wetherall at the Charing Cross Corporate Office. I will however await the outcome of the meeting alluded to in the opening message of this thread from Nigel.
On the subject of interest, our current account interest for 2006 was £102.49, compared to £272.78 for 2005. As far as I can recall (bank statements currently with Independent Examiner) our average balance would have been similar across both years (if not actually higher in 2006). We also do not appear to have received credit interest with the same frequency, which I will be looking into further.
If it’s any help in terms of the negotiations with Nat West, our PCC will be looking to move our current account to a bank which does not impose charges should the Nat West persist with this policy. |
Alan McCullough
New member
Username: Amccullough
Post Number: 8
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 20, 2007 - 10:13 pm: | |
HSBC raised the charges on our accounts at St Matthew's (but not for St Luke's) a few years ago on the grounds that they felt they weren't making enough money out of servicing our account.
I looked at moving to the co-op (were we had one account), and natwest (where I bank personally) but couldn't get favourable terms. Eventually I moved all of our banking to Cafbank thereby reducing our charges to a minimum and earning around 3.7% interest on our current account. We still pay cash in via HSBC and most of our payments are now done by on-line transfer rather than by cheque. If you haven't got a local branch of HSBC then try opening a treasurers account at Alliance & Leicester (where you can bank via the post office), Halifax or even RBS (where you can still bank via the Natwest). |
David Evershed
New member
Username: Evershed
Post Number: 5
Registered: 12-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, April 5, 2007 - 3:31 pm: | |
Marsh Gibbon has also recently had bank charges for the first time and challenged them.
Having spoken with NatWest and ODBF the pooling/sweep arrangement means we get a good rate of interest (dependent upon the investments for the cash which are specified by our central people).
However, in exchange we start paying bank charges at 25% of the commercial rate once we go over £25,000 pa turnover (credits in). Below £25,000 pa turnover banking is free. As turnover rises then so does the proportion of commercial rate that is paid. We just happened to go over the £25,000pa level (although we did have a £100,000 turnover on the development account a few years back but did not pay bank charges). |
Dennis Offer
New member
Username: Bourton
Post Number: 1
Registered: 4-2007
| | Posted on Friday, April 6, 2007 - 11:34 am: | |
This cropped up at our PCC meetings last year. Having worked for Lloyds, I was disgusted to hear they had started charging charities and churches. In my opinion, the Church as a whole needs to be more active in its approach to costs. As an entity, the Church generates massive funds through the banks and could negotiate a free banking service for its accounts, I'm sure. The Church is not a well organised body and its financial structuring can be a bit archaic at times. But I do think this is good way of using its weight and could save large amounts of needed funds nationally, with the use of a little persuasion. |
David Evershed
New member
Username: Evershed
Post Number: 6
Registered: 12-2006
| | Posted on Friday, April 6, 2007 - 3:31 pm: | |
Re Dennis Offer comment.
The church (Oxford Diocesan BF) has negotiated free banking with Nat West (see my post number 5). However, this is only completely free for those with turnover of less than £25,000pa. For higher turnovers, a proportion of commercial charges are made.
Plus there is a sweep arrangement whereby Nat West invests the combined participating parishes overnight funds in the instruments specified by the church to maximise returns, given the liquidity and risk constraints.
Regarding the charging policy of banks, the "clubs charities and society" accounts are loss making for banks in total, although many customer accounts (with high transaction volumes and low balances) are being subsidised by other customers (with low transaction volumes but high balances).
Introducing transaction charges and paying interest on credit balances makes current accounts much fairer, as well as making it transparent, instead of having hidden subsidies from one customer to another. |
Dennis Offer
New member
Username: Bourton
Post Number: 2
Registered: 4-2007
| | Posted on Saturday, April 7, 2007 - 10:08 am: | |
Thank you David. I wasn't aware of this, although I'm new to this board. However, it doesn't help us a lot as we are rural and the nearest NatWest is miles away.
As far as your last comments are concerned, I think most people would expect the banks to subsidised these groups, in the same way their customers do, financially and physically!
Bank charges are a costing based on expectations. I recall calculating charges on the basis of costs set out by the bank, which are effectively fictitious. The figures are based on probables and estimates and include margins which the banks write in. This has been highlighted recently in the press, with regards to exhorbitant charges for exceeding overdrafts and sending back cheques etc.
The banks make their profits from investing our money which we lodge with them, and lending it out at far higher rates elsewhere. Charges tend to be a 'penalty' for the excessive use of the account, or a levy for businesses (which I pay in abundance, as a businessman!!!). Unlike you, I see no morale grounds for introducing charges to charities, which the bamks have never done previously, when they are making record, massive profits. I'm afraid I differ with you view of 'fair'. |
Nigel Doughton
New member
Username: Nigeldoughton
Post Number: 2
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 15, 2007 - 11:14 am: | |
The charges on our bank account (Lloyds TSB) have started to rise and I'm looking at alternatives. Can anyone help me with experiences (positive or negative) of CAF bank?
We can get to an HSBC branch easily as we are in the centre of Aylesbury.
Many thanks
Nigel |
Caroline Bucklow
New member
Username: Caroline_bucklow
Post Number: 3
Registered: 2-2007
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 16, 2007 - 7:12 am: | |
I have used CAF bank with two charities in my day job and have had very positive experiences with them. The only reason I haven't switched for the PCC is that Wallingford doesn't have a branch of HSBC. |
Steve Wells
New member
Username: Swells
Post Number: 6
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 19, 2007 - 6:17 pm: | |
On querying recent NatWest bank charges, I have received the email below. Please can you comment?
"I have been forwarded your letter regarding the account charges and I am
currently investigating - it appears that after a recent meeting with the
Oxford Diocese it was agreed to review which churches were to be charges and
which ones were not to be charged.
A Service Charge Agreement Schedule was sent to the Oxford Diocese to advise
of the tariff that we would be using, however it appears that it has not yet
been filtered through to the individual Parochial Church Councils. I have
been unable to reach the Diocese office to confirm receipt of the Schedule
so I will send it across to yourself in another e-mail.
If you have any questions, or if you require any further information, then
please do not hesitate to contact me on the telephone number detailed below.
Kindest Regards,
Alan Bestow
Portfolio Manager
Charing Cross CBC
3rd Floor Cavell House
2a Charing Cross Road
London WC2H 0NN
Depot:190 |
Nigel Wearne
Moderator
Username: Nwearne
Post Number: 45
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Friday, January 4, 2008 - 9:18 am: | |
Steve Wells posting is news to me. We have had no communication regarding this. I shall post a reply when I have communicated with NatWest. |
Kevin Ryan
New member
Username: Kpryan
Post Number: 5
Registered: 5-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 20, 2008 - 2:47 pm: | |
Spam removal |
|
The views expressed here are those of the poster. The Diocese of Oxford does not endorse any opinion posted here.
Copyright © 2006 Oxford Diocesan Publications Ltd. Credits Privacy
|
Searching the Board
This discussion board can be searched by time of post and keyword from the Search screen. This searching mechanisms provide convenient methods to locate discussions of interest. Rules and Netiquette
When writing your messages, please use the same courtesy that you would show when speaking face-to-face with someone. Flames, insults, and personal attacks will not be tolerated. It's fine to disagree strongly with opinions, ideas, and facts, but always with respect for the other person. Great minds do not always think alike, and that's where the fun is! Also, note that messages express the thoughts of the writers, not the board or its moderators. 
|
